Forum Topic

Over Flow on Chiswick High Road Pavement

Morning AllHeaded to Chiswick high for a coffee this morning on my Crutches 🩼 after a  bad Fall .Never noticed before to be honest but the overflow on the Pavements makes some parts of it a tight squeeze.From restaurants to Pubs and stalls I know it’s tough out there for everyone but just be carefull.and doesn’t help with people having the heads down on the mobile phone.

John Kennedy ● 27d24 Comments

Although tree roots can be a trip hazard, they come with a warning sign (a very big tree next to them) so even partially sighted people know to take extra care. Uneven pavements can crop up anywhere.

Diane Brown ● 11d

There probably has been some traffic evaporation which may partly account for lower bridge crossings but there will also have been significant displacement specifically of logistics where deliveries are now likely to be made from depots on the same side of the river. Or put another way, nobody in Barnes orders a takeaway from Hammersmith any more. On the latest numbers I could find (from TfL), Chiswick Bridge does seem to have a fallen in crossings 2018-2024 as does Wandsworth but Kew Bridge seem back to where it was, as is Putney according to this data. Fleur Anderson is quoting figures from the DfT which she claims shows a 16% increase over Putney Bridge and Wandsworth Council’s own automatic traffic count data shows a 25% increase in traffic during the morning peak hours between 2019-2023. They say data from TFL has also confirmed that bus journey and waiting times have worsened. Labour’s Wandsworth Council leader Simon Hogg said, “The ongoing closure of Hammersmith Bridge has placed an unacceptable burden on the people of Wandsworth. Following the closure over five years ago, traffic has got increasingly worse on our local roads, resulting in regular gridlock and longer journey times for people commuting to work, school, and vital appointments. Businesses are struggling, emergency vehicles are delayed, buses are delayed, and our community is rightly frustrated at the inaction and lack of progress to reopen this key river crossing.” A reduced number of crossings doesn’t necessarily mean reduced traffic as this is also impacted by the average speed. I couldn’t find any data for the year before Hammersmith closed but all these bridges have seen a decline in average speeds comparing 2019 (a quarter of which the bridge was open) and 2023 including Chiswick Bridge despite the fall in the number of vehicles crossing. The balance between fewer or the same amount of vehicles and the slowing of the pace at which they cross seems to be tipped in favour of the latter so these bridges are now more congested. Of course this could be down to a general rise in congestion and not specifically due to Hammersmith Bridge but I doubt it.

Andrew OSullivan ● 16d

These seem to be a different set of figures than the ones you quoted when I asked for your claim that South Parade was busier than the High Road when you referred to 'Ealing monitoring reports'.It is entirely possible that by selecting figures possibly collected in different times in different ways you might be able to find a higher number for South Parade than Chiswick High Road. The date you quote in September 2022 is during the major works that were taking place on the A4 which regularly brought the High Road to a standstill which possibly indicates there were more cars managing to progress along South Parade at that time because it was still flowing.Can I suggest if they data you are looking at leads you to a conclusion that seems unlikely, rather than assuming it is correct, you should subject it to a sanity check by going to have a look at these two roads yourself? You'll quickly realise that it is nonsense to claim South Parade carries more traffic. I wouldn't let this get you down - we all make mistakes.

Francis Rowe ● 17d

We have data for the exact same period on both roads, a week from 20/9/2022. Traffic was always higher on South Parade over these seven days, ranging from 5% above on Sunday, when the High Road is comparatively busier, to 25% on Fridays. The reason people pay for traffic counts is because what might be "obvious" to some is not necessarily what is occurring. That's certainly true of Hammersmith Bridge, where you were not alone in predicting that "obviously" traffic would increase on the neighbouring bridges after the closure. In fact the latest traffic counts from TfL show that traffic across Kew, Chiswick, Putney and Wandsworth bridges was 10% lower in both 2022  and 2024 compared to the levels in 2016 and 2018. To be fair, I was not expecting an actual decline either. Traffic evaporation would explain why at least some of the traffic on Hammersmith did not reappear on the other bridges, but it does not explain why traffic on the remaining bridges has actually fallen after the closure.

Tom Pike ● 20d

There obviously aren't more cars going up and down South Parade each day than the High Road even though there does seem to have been an increase over the last few years. Not sure about Acton Lane though, that is regularly congested, although rarely back to South Parade. What I've found over recent years is that if you are approaching Chiswick Roundabout on the M4/A4 from the west is that for the first time ever you are directed away from Chiswick High Road and up the North Circular to reach Chiswick via Gunnersbury Lane. This is a displacement of traffic onto more residential streets including Bollo Lane.

Andrew OSullivan ● 20d

Yes, it’s possible an amount of traffic was displaced to South Parade from the High Road and a slightly larger amount displaced from South Parade to other streets, so the total dropped a little. What’s the new elements of the obstacle course?

Tom Pike ● 21d

Nowadays trees can be planted with systems such as Treeparker which encourage the roots to go further down.

Philippa Bond ● 21d

I recall we’ve had a discussion before about traffic being displaced onto South Parade from CHR since it’s become such an obstacle course.  Many locals spotted this straight away but I recall some experts rejected this as being mere ‘anecdotal evidence’ (of one’s own eyes?) not supported by other data. I suppose the figures could be interpreted as traffic on South Parade not necessarily being displaced from CHR, though how you’d ever know without stopping and asking people.

Peter Evans ● 21d

Chiswick High Road at the last DfT manual count in 2018 carried just under 15,000 vehicles. The previous count in 2009 gave a similar number. In 2021, camera counts commenced, verified by 40 manual counts, giving an average of just under 9000 vehicles a day. The subsequent camera data show all the subsequent counts below 10,000, with an average of 8500. Counts below 10,000 cars a day is not a "huge amount of traffic"  and it's more than a third lower than seen in 2018. The A315 is not a major east-west route by any standards.South Parade had 10,000 vehicles on it before the pandemic and dipped slightly after Fishers Lane was closed, as shown in the Ealing monitoring reports. There's no sign that traffic from the High Road has been displaced to it. As Richard said, through traffic should use the A4  - it's effectively the Chiswick bypass.

Tom Pike ● 21d

That's extraordinary if true. What is the source for these numbers. 8,000 vehicles a day is a huge amount of traffic and South Parade is already struggling to cope with the volume it is required to handle which is not surprising if it is 10,000 and it wouldn't be able to handle more displaced traffic if the High Road was restricted further.

Francis Rowe ● 21d

"It's an A road with a huge amount of through traffic."The High Road now carries less motor traffic than South Parade, 8000 daily vehicles on CHR compared to 10,000 on South Parade. The A4 carries more than ten times the traffic of the High Road. Buses could still use the High Road, and they'd travel faster.

Tom Pike ● 22d

"It's an A road with a huge amount of through traffic." While Chiswick High Road is indeed part of the A315, most through traffic would tend to use the A4. I don't support the idea of closing CHR, but I doubt whether many heading west from Hammersmith towards the M4 would choose it as their primary route.

Richard Greenhough ● 22d

I find it hard to understand why the plainly bonkers idea of closing the High Road keeps rearing its ugly head from time to time. It's an A road with a huge amount of through traffic. Yes it would be lovely if it wasn't there but it plays a key part in the road infrastructure of west London. Perhaps if you shut it you would get some traffic evaporation but most journeys on this road do not start or finish in Chiswick and a significant amount of congestion will be directed onto nearby B roads.  It is clear that people proposing this have never used a bus but crippling this service is only going to lead to more car journeys. Such obviously impractical suggestions are a pointless distraction from the important point raised by John originally not least because if they actually did deliver the Chiswick consumer boom their proponents claim, his daily challenges would get worse.  A quick easy solution would be a total ban on A boards on the central section of CHR, Devonshire Road and Turnham Green Terrace.

Francis Rowe ● 22d

Yes, the large trees can be a problem and it may be difficult to walk over the humped tarmac (or resin bonded gravel) BUT when you don't lift your feet well as you walk I think you start to get to know where the problem areas are.  It can be worse when the pavement looks fine but when you stand on one end of a paving stone it tips up catching the following foot!  We need the trees and it takes so long for them to grow big enough to give any shade that removing them is not very popular.  Some kerb stones become dislodged by being driven over and others are sitting at a ridiculous angle due to tree root disruption but remain in place to cause damage particularly when wet and need reporting about and action rather than just moaning about.

Philippa Bond ● 25d

Perversely, most damage to our pavements seems to be caused by all those lovely trees planted way back when that are now pushing up the paving with their extensive roots. Where the council has tried to fix this in our street, they’re replaced the dislocated paving and kerbstones with an undulating hump of tarmac which still needs care to walk over. I assume they couldn’t make it level for fear of damaging the roots, so we still have something of an assault course.

Peter Evans ● 25d

Pavements can be hazardous to those that use them all year round.  There is a lot of damage done by irresponsible vehicle drivers, utility companies and builders.  Some people never leave hospital and others have their lives changed forever.  Please report damage and those that danage them.

Philippa Bond ● 25d

Strangely its many of the very businesses who would, you'd think, get a boost that are convinced the traffic sewer is what keeps them afloat.

Will Watson ● 26d

Yes, such a hazard in March!

N V Brooks ● 26d

I think businesses can get permission to spread onto the pavement as long as they leave at least two metres clear.  This disproportionately takes away from our extra wide CHR pavements which in places seem to be obscured by flower stalls when in fact there’s a comparatively narrow ‘legal’ passage through them. Perversely, the pavements in Richmond feel more open as they’re too narrow to allow any obstructions on them. Similarly, cyclist don’t seem to be attracted to the narrow, pedestrian filled Richmond pavements while they can’t resist the inviting wide open spaces provided alongside CHR!

Peter Evans ● 26d

How about closing to traffic on Sundays to start with?That'd be an interesting experiment.Man, it sounds nice doesn't it. Just imagine.

Simon Pedley ● 26d

About time the High Road and TGT was closed to through traffic. Would give these businesses a huge boost and greatly improve out town. 

John Hall ● 26d

And Christmas trees on the pavement:  Such a horrible trip hazard present for pedestrians.

Philippa Bond ● 26d

One of the few benefits of the pandemic was that more cafes and restaurants were able to take advantage of pavement space outside their premises and this has to be a good thing. It does however mean that the remaining space is at a premium and therefore a bit more enforcement of the rules against unnecessary clutter such as A boards and carelessly deposited bin bags is needed.

Andrew OSullivan ● 26d

John. Be very careful.  Sometimes people approach you three abreast and busy nattering.  We have decided it is better to just stand still so that they have to avoid you instead of trying to dodge out of the way.  We're not all as agile as we used to be!

Philippa Bond ● 26d

Councils need to rein in shops who think its their right to have their advertising boards on the pavement outside. Especially if the pavement is narrow.

peter king ● 27d