From the front page.......What Do You Think About the 'Safer Cycle Pathway?' Council wants to hear the views of people who use King Street. The council says that when the consultation is complete, the feedback will be analysed to help the cabinet to decide on the future of the scheme.So Transport for London have apparently spent over a million pounds on something that may not have a future????
Carol Burge ● 94d26 Comments
> The cycle network is barely out of the womb, let alone in its infancy. There will be much much more to come .....These threads get ever more bizarre.
Russell Pearson ● 91d
Hi Tom, interesting anecdote. I first went to Barnes over 30 years ago, Sunday lunch at the Sun Inn was a regular thing, though I admit one of a couple of friends took it turn to drive. It was always packed, reservations a must, and in good weather the green opposite was always super busy. Indeed the whole area always seemed to be 'buzzing'. Barnes has a long standing appeal.So its quite hard to see and facts or data in your view. I am sure some on Castelnau might like a large, wide road being closed to nearly all traffic. But then some weekends, as I am sure you must also know, the queue to reach Chiswick bridge can reach back along Lower Richmond Rd along Mortlake High st to reach as far as Barnes Railway bridge. So always winners and losers in these things. What we dont have is any sense of a coherent plan to manage traffic and road use across London. As we see with the recent traffic gridlock in W4, there are too many commuters who drive into London every day. With Elizabeth line now open and the excellent public transport in London, its time for a proper plan to address this.
Bill George ● 92d
The “two wrongs” are not equivalent are they. It is long past due for the police to take red light jumping seriously and start cracking down on drivers before they kill even more people. I saw two on the school run today. Utterly irresponsible to go through red lights when you can see kids waiting to cross. That’s assuming they even saw them and weren’t glued to their phones.
Ed Saper ● 92d
I agree, there the angle needs to be smoothed though the lights work well with minimal delay to both motor traffic and bikes. There is a route down along Bridge Ave. They need responsive signals as you go under the flyover, just like at the crossover, and Hammersmith Bridge back in operation for active travel.Coincidently I was in Barnes earlier today and even in the rain the place is buzzing. I think retail there has on the whole benefitted from not being on a cut through from the A4 to the A3. It’s just a more pleasant place to spend time.
Tom Pike ● 92d
"1) no protected way to go from the south (eg Barnes through the bridge"Patience. We are 50 years behind civilised countries in creating a functioning urban road surface transport system. The cycle network is barely out of the womb, let alone in its infancy. There will be much much more to come .....
Paul Campbell ● 92d
Well they never get anything right first time do they ? Why is that? How many times will this take and how much money ? Genuine criticism based on past performance
Maggie Dodge ● 92d
Personally, I think the cycleway in Hammersmith has two shortfalls: 1) no protected way to go from the south (eg Barnes through the bridge 2) the 90 degrees jump from one side of King St to the other by the old Hammersmith city council office. That ought to be revisited.
Francis Sheehan ● 92d
You are still thinking in terms of a residential street providing “relief” for arterial routes. That type of thinking is obsolete.
Michael Robinson ● 93d
Hi Michael/Jeremy,Personal opinion is that allowing traffic along Weltje Road to join the A4 takes some pressure off the nearest two points where traffic can join the A4 from north of the A4 i.e. via Chiswick Lane (nr Hogarth roundabout) or via Beadon Rd (nr Hammersmith Bdy).Unlike the situation with Stile Hall Gardens, there isn't a bus lane "by pass" that buses can use to get past the displaced traffic if you were to cause more car traffic along Chiswick Lane or Beadon Road by closing Weltje access to the A4.Of course, that's what I think would happen, the reality could be different.
Andrew Jones ● 93d
Torrential rain on CS3 this evening and it is full of cyclists. I remember before the cycle lane on an evening like this I would see a handful of other cyclists. The lanes make it easier for people to cycle in the dark and in bad weather.
Paul Campbell ● 93d
Cycling doesn’t disappear in winter. There’s certainly a seasonal variation, as there is with car counts, but it’s still 60% of summer numbers on C9.
Tom Pike ● 93d
LBHF don’t need to consider Chiswick Lane or Sutton Court Rd. They aren’t the Highway Authority for those roads. When the consultation comes out Hounslow can respond like everyone else.The volume of traffic along Weltje and Rivercourt while too high for narrow residential streets will not make a material difference if it goes via the gyratory and Hogarth roundabout. Residential streets are not relief roads for arterial routes. If they were, then streets like Homefields and Netheravon would also have access to the A4.The penny doesn’t seem to have dropped with you that private car traffic is the lowest priority. That’s why improvements of the streets for residents and improvements of safety at junctions with a large number of cyclists and school children will be prioritised higher than the convenience of drivers.
Michael Robinson ● 93d
It looks pretty irreversible to me. What's the point of asking now? It's great for a few cyclists, me included, and awful for drivers, buses, and emergency services. I would suggest that the sections that have sensible screwed-in posts, like King St, could be removed in winter and revert to bus lane, if physically possible, lets say from Nov to March. We dont cycle in winter. We shouldnt really be holding up traffic for a few intrepids.
Stephen Gould ● 93d
Schools are now back from half-term - presumably that has something to do with traffic.
Philippa Bond ● 93d
"Chiswick Lane isn’t in LBHF so they don’t care if traffic diverts to there."That's pretty cynical!
Andrew Jones ● 93d
An ANPR enforced residential exemption might work but probably would be ruled out on safety grounds as there is a risk of a vehicle breaking suddenly on the A4 at the entrance to Rivercourt Road as they try and work out the signs.I don't think borough tranport departments would have such a beggar-thy-neighbour attitude to traffic planning and besides the wash back from delays at the CL/CHR junction will also affect LBHF residents. I think they will have some consideration for the residents of Chiswick Lane even though they are not in their borough.They'd also need to consider the Sutton Court Road junction which would experience increased pressure and once again this is an accident black spot that doesn't need extra demand.I'm pretty sure my posting record will show that I have consistently been in favour or the Wellesley Road closures and have only argued for Fishers Lane to reopen at times of extreme stress for the local road network so I am not dogmatically opposed to shutting off roads. It seems to me that the benefits of closing or restricting access to Rivercourt/Weltje (improved quality of life for residents and improved safety on the cycleway) are outweighed by the disbenefits (deteriorating quality of life for Chiswick Lane and Chiswick High Road residents, pollution and congestion on CHR, slower buses and increased danger at the CHR/CL junction, the Rivercourt/A4 junction and possibly the A4/SCR junction).
Jeremy Parkinson ● 93d
“I very much doubt that H&F would consider closing them to through traffic.”They may not totally close the roads at the A4 but I predict they will heavily restrict through traffic (there will possibly be a residential exemption)Chiswick Lane isn’t in LBHF so they don’t care if traffic diverts to there.Weltje and Rivercourt Rds are the only residential streets between the gyratory and Hogarth roundabout with access to the A4 so are very much an anomaly.Every other road closure in the area (like Wellesley Rd, Fishers Lane…) has had people posting on this forum claiming that it can’t be done before it has been done.
Michael Robinson ● 93d
Agree about Rivercourt Road which is a junction you learn to approach with caution if approaching on a bike from the west. There also appears to be much more traffic on this road recently which presumably is something to do with the throttling effect of the cycleway on King Street.I don't think Rivercourt Road and Weltje Road are rat runs in the way this term is generally understood and I very much doubt that H&F would consider closing them to through traffic. To do so would divert more traffic along Chiswick Lane which is also a residential road and through the problematic junction with Chiswick High Road which people will not need reminding was the scene of a serious accident involving a cyclist a few weeks back.The management of traffic on the High Road seems to involved the throttling of vehicles westbound and shutting Weltje would lengthen these queues leading to a further deterioration of air quality for people living near what has become a semi-permanent line of traffic during the day.Nevertheless, there is a safety issue at the Weltje Road and Rivercourt Road junctions that needs consideration but more signage is probably a better response.
Jeremy Parkinson ● 93d
The junction of Rivercourt Rd and King Street is an accident waiting to happen. For traffic emerging from Rivercourt there's an enormous plane tree which obscures the motorist's view of cyclists approaching from the left.
Robert Fish ● 93d
The Weltje Road access to the A4 has been a mystery to me for decades. At some point they made it one way - presumably to stop rat running from the A4 into Hammersmith.The result of this was to make it a perfect way (no oncoming traffic) to join the A4 without using the gyratory.
Will Watson ● 93d
I also cycle that route 3 to 5 days a week and cycling across the gyratory is dramatically better. Previously I simply wouldn't have attempted cycling round the gyratory westbound and would have pushed/scooted my bike around the Broadway. The phasing of lights for cycling westbound is pretty good and once you get a green, there is minimal waiting.The wands along Hammersmith Rd are adequate, but could be improved. Coming back westbound in the evening, it is a relief reaching them after the Mad Max experience along the Kensington High St traffic sewer.There is too much traffic using Rivercourt and Weltje Rds which are ratruns to and from the A4. As a minimum, they need similar junction treatments that Hounslow has implemented between Goldhawk Rd and Chiswick Lane (and is currently implementing west of Chiswick Lane).The best solution would be to close off access at the A4 with Rivercourt and Weltje Rds. I think some sort of restrictions there are likely to be part of LBHF's LTN plan, with the Ravenscourt area being later in 2023, after the Brackenbury area.
Michael Robinson ● 94d
I cycle that route every day, and while King Street and the gyratory is great, Hammersmith Road is still a marked improvement, even though provision is patchy. The really big change comes at Kensington High Street where car dominance of the entire road takes over, with the short-lived cycle lanes now dotted with illegal parking.
Tom Pike ● 94d
I doubt very much they have any intention of tearing it up but the consultation could identify improvements. The borough boundary is very evident when you cycle from CHR to King Street with the Hounslow section being leaf strewn and filled with standing water while the H&F section is regularly swept and has been designed by engineers who understood something about drainage.Overall cycling on the King Street section is a pleasure until you get to the junction with Hammersmith Road when the description 'Safer Cycle Pathway' becomes a textbook example of Orwellian doublespeak.
Jeremy Parkinson ● 94d