Forum Topic

new Chiswick Cycleway

I recommend anyone who hasn't already and is capable, to try the completed stretch of the new cycle way along Chiswick High road. It is now a pleasure to cycle along Chiswick High road and it's wonderful to see all ages enjoying themselves.  It used to be extremely dangerous cycling in the direction of Hammersmith weaving between cars and parked cars suddenly opening car doors without care . When other sections of the cycleway are completed hopefully those new to cycling will give it a try and experience its many benefits.

Robert Glen ● 1974d64 Comments

You might want to keep an eye out for the cars using the cycle lane. That and blind turnings caused by TfL not adhering to their own design guidance resulting in a dangerous cycleway. Good luck out there. You're gonna need it.

David Lesniak ● 1974d

It is a bit of a dog's dinner for both cars, removing road space & turning across it, & cyclists running red lights & into pedestrians on the crossing by the bus stop - seen that twice too often.More than a couple of times, as a pedestrian, I've had to dodge cyclists riding into me at both the Dukes Ave turn and more frequently by the Chiswick Lane lights when the pedestrian Green Man is clearly 'on'.Also, I've seen a few cars up from Hammersmith or turning left from Chiswick Lane running straight into the cycle lane as the signage is pretty poor.  A big visible arrow pointing cars to the road would be a great help - they have these on roundabouts in France which I found very comforting when I drove there.As a cyclist it's great to have a separation from cars but the continuous 'stop/start' & ped xing by the bus stop can be a pain. London seems too small to accommodate both cars & the growing number of cyclists.I wonder if there was a similar problem when cars became more numerous than horses?The question is how can we make the environment safe & smooth for all of us?

Martin Weaver ● 1974d

Robert, yes it's a brilliant cycle route. Happy cycling on Route CR9 everyone ! All that needs to be done now is to make the rest of CHR into a two lane bus route, job done. Happy motoring to all !

Chris Vessey ● 1974d

“London seems too small to accommodate both cars & the growing number of cyclists.“The growing number of cyclists is exactly the aim of providing protected cycling routes. If people are choosing to cycle rather than drive then the overall load on London’s roads will drop. As far as the High Road is concerned, as the number of cars grew, pavement and tram lines that were removed to accommodate the increased space they required, followed by pushing the A4 through after the war. Hopefully, we are seeing the reversal of the trend of allocating an ever increasing proportion of the area of London to motor vehicles.

Tom Pike ● 1974d

I don't use the High Road on a daily basis on my bike but a comparison of journey times before and after the Cycleway's introduction suggests the journey time on the stretch between Chiswick Lane and Heathfield Terrace takes about 2 minutes longer than it used to on average. That of course is assuming that red lights are not ignored.In the evening and very early in the morning you do have the option of staying out of the cycleway but most of the rest of the time the road is too congested to do this. There are some families who have been emboldened to bring their kids out on the cycleway since in opened which is a good thing although I've seen more evidence of this on social media than I have when actually cycling myself on the route.There does seem to be something of a lack of strategic thinking here - encouraging leisure cycling by families on a A road shouldn't really be the top priority. Significant modal shift only really takes place when you persuade people to do a journey they do daily by bike - this isn't going to happen if you make it slower.

Mark Evans ● 1974d

I start my commute into Central London along CS9 and it's the best part of the route until you reach Hyde Park and the permanent lanes, especially the ride of death up Kensington High Street since they ripped their cycle lane out.  And it's safe now to navigate central Chiswick with the kids on bikes. So that's progress in my book. It's still easy to get out of town on the A4/M4 by car. Chiswick becoming more pleasant by the day with the improving weather and more people out and about on foot and 2 wheels.

John Hall ● 1974d

I wouldn't recommend the new cycle lane to my worst enemy, let alone anyone wanting to 'enjoy themselves'. If in doubt, just ask the number of people who have already been knocked off and injured as a result of it being put in. But please feel free to give it a go, particularly if you have a death wish, and enjoy sucking up all the extra pollution on the High Road, caused by the increase in traffic that has resulted from taking out the all important bus lane.Better make it quick, though - it will all have been taken out by the end of August, and not a moment too soon...

Mark Edwards ● 1974d

Mark, your post made me chuckle and am totally in your camp.  I do hope you are right they will be taken out in August. But then, what other horrors may the ones who want to make life miserable inflict on us after that.  There is no end to their scheming to make the lives of people in Ealing and Hounslow utterly wretched.

Claire Moran ● 1974d

I often walk past the entrance to the bus station and from time to time stop  to have a quick chat with bus drivers.A delightful lady driver told me a couple of days ago that on a bad day the bus could be up to half an hour late arriving at it's final destination since the loss of the bus lane.If any of you don't want to believe me go and have a chat yourselves.

Adrian Irving ● 1974d

How long since the bus lane was replaced by the cycle lane, I can’t find the date? Why is there still a need to encourage cyclists to use it?

Maggie Dodge ● 1974d

I agree with you Robert. The Cycleway is packed now and there are plenty of children using it too. I’m hopeful that Hammersmith and Fulham will allow its extension towards Hammersmith soon.

Edward Seaton ● 1974d

"The Cycleway is packed now..."My home overlooks C9 on CHR and you saying it's packed is a flight of fancy, unless you're referring to another C9 in a parallel universe ? The pavements on the stretch of the High Road see greater cycling traffic

Loraine Pemberton ● 1974d

Whether it’s chats with bus drivers or simply looking at traffic, we’ll often come away feeling our views have been confirmed. A good example is the time lapse video the Daily Mail put up claiming there were hardly any cyclists using C9. In fact more than one hundred could be seen in the video, and more likely missed. Decisions should be made using actual data on bus times and traffic counts.

Tom Pike ● 1974d

Unfortunately, it looks like somebody does not want an informed decision to be made:https://chiswickcalendar.co.uk/automatic-traffic-counters-ripped-out-in-grove-park/

Tom Pike ● 1974d

It may not be packed but there has been a substantial increase in cycling in the area. However, this has happened generally across London and is down to Covid and an explosion in the use of services like Deliveroo (whose riders incidentally rarely seem to use the Cycleway).There has definitely been an increase in the number of families cycling together on the High Road and this is likely to rise further now summer may have actually started. This is obviously great but I get the impression many of this trips have little real practical purpose and are often mainly to parade the parents' virtue and fecundity and could just as easily been walked. As these eco-aware families were unlikely to have previously driven the journey there is little or no modal shift going on here.The original superhighway concept was that cycling commuting journey times would be reduced and cycleways opened earlier on appear to have achieved this with a very significant rise in cycling after their introduction. However, TfL found that the rise was predominantly among commuters with most of the increase in cycling being by white middle class males.Somewhere between the original conception of CS9 and the building of C9 the emphasised changed to safety rather than speed and the aim was to get more people particularly from those groups who had previously been less likely to cycle to start.While we don't know if C9 is actually safer yet it is certainly less intimidating than it used to be for inexperienced cyclists and those lacking in confidence and these are definitely more evident than they used to be.What we don't know, and what will be fiendishly difficult to measure because of all the other factors impacting traffic patterns at the moment, is how much the increase in cycling commute times along Chiswick High Road is reducing people using it as their primary work to route. As this type of journey is longer and concentrated at peak times changes in habits will be more impactful than parents and kids tootling down to Kew at the weeked.

Mark Evans ● 1974d

'The original superhighway concept was that cycling commuting journey times would be reduced'Is that true?I know the 'super highway' brand was originally used for protected cycle ways but they never seemed designed to speed up cycle commuting - if anything the opposite. Take the one along the embankment. It was quicker to cycle along the road before it was introduced yet this has been an extraordinary success with commuting cyclists - perhaps speed is not the most important thing for the average cyclist?

Will Watson ● 1974d

Claire you are a very ardent anti-cycling fanatic clearly. The cycle route is the best thing to hit CHR. Now what needs to be done is to stop all private motorcars from entering but reintroduce bus lanes. Only then will cyclists be safe from uncaring motorists of which there are many.

Chris Vessey ● 1973d

Not at all. Just fed up with the anti-car lobby and worried about the huge risks to pedestrians, motorists and cyclists with the totally stupid scheme on the High Road, and, in particular, tp  the elderly and disabled.  Oh, and thanks for spelling my name right for once.

Claire Moran ● 1973d

I counted quite a few damaged traffic counters this morning in Grove Park.What are the cowards afraid of? What do they think the data will say.

Matthew Swain ● 1973d

Traffic counts (when the sensors are not ripped out) give the change in numbers each hour so it’s straightforward to compare the change in counts in peak commute hours and the rest of the day. For example, the High Road cycle counts last September, prior to C9 becoming operational, showed that while cycle numbers had stayed broadly similar, the major growth was during the day between the commuting peaks.

Tom Pike ● 1973d

While my cab crawled up the High Road last week on the way to my vet in Richmond with a sick cat, the driver and I were unanimous in our views that it was a totally mad idea. In nearly 30 minutes late pm while stuck in traffic that was barely moving and couldn't move out of the way for an ambulance, we counted - two cyclists.

Claire Moran ● 1973d

'What are the cowards afraid of? What do they think the data will say. 'Best guess is that traffic has been displaced from one road in the area to another.

Francis Rowe ● 1973d

Cllr Hearn: “When the council doesn’t communicate with people it’s not surprising a few of them take exception to things they don’t understand."That's hardly likely. Whoever systematically damages a large number of traffic counters must have known exactly what they are.

Tom Pike ● 1973d

Don't need to speak to the bus drivers to tell me that, I use the buses and the journeys are a complete mess now - takes ages to get from King Street to the bus garage. As I have said before, having used the buses pre-pandemic for over 8 years to get to and from work I would possibly have to bail out in King Street and walk the rest of the way due to some terrible traffic incident maybe 3 or 4 times a year. Since the bus lane has been removed, that has happened at least 4 times over a period of 3 weeks - and that is just using the bus now and again - not every day. It's a joke using public transport now.

J Morse ● 1973d

No evidence of that in the previous survey when they didn't vandalise the counters.  Maybe they didn't like the results?https://chiswickcalendar.co.uk/dramatic-drops-in-traffic-in-south-chiswick/The current survey will measure effectiveness of measures using cameras which weren't in place for the previous survey.  It will be interesting to see how effective cameras actually are.

Michael Robinson ● 1973d

I think we can take it as read that putting up a camera on a road and fining people will reduce the number of people using it.The people who damaged the counters were clearly morons. If they were opposed to the measures the council will, with some justification, say they need to extend the trial. What has been achieved by this is that we can be sure the restrictions will be in place longer than they might otherwise have been.Data obviously should be collected and analysed on these measures as part of the decision making process but as we have seen with the Steer review report it is very difficult to reach firm conclusions about what is causing changes in traffic patterns overall because there are so many factors radically impacting usage.The approach adopted by Ealing Council in their reviews should be adopted by Hounslow and residents should decide which measures to keep and which to get rid of in a CPZ style consultation exercise.

Francis Rowe ● 1973d

Thank you for backing me up JM.Tom has stated that talking to the bus drivers would be a waste of his time.Three monkeys come to mind.

Adrian Irving ● 1973d

"I think we can take it as read that putting up a camera on a road and fining people will reduce the number of people using it."Yes, but they actual size of the reduction will be the interesting point. If the reductions aren't that significant, then that would seem to indicate that signage and fining people isn't particularly effective at reducing through traffic in the locations where they have been deployed.  The measures are being done under an experimental traffic order so the whole point is to find this out.I think it is pretty clear that in the case of Harvard Hill for example, the reduction in in northbound traffic is a result of the barrier and no entry sign to the A4.  There is no change to southbound traffic which is primarily journeys by residents rather than through traffic.

Michael Robinson ● 1973d

The data are also used to evaluate the impact on surrounding roads that do not have restrictions. For example, the cables were cut on the ATCs at Burlington Lane and the one near Edensor Road on Sutton Court Road.It is in everybody's interest for the data to be gathered and assessed. If the data prove that traffic flows have increased dramatically on Burlington Lane then the trial will have demonstrated conclusively that is a detrimnental outcome of the experimental measures in place.It is also in everybody's interest for the local Councillors not to find it so easy to excuse organised criminal activity. Society doesn't accept that people can destroy property because they don't understand why it is there.

Paul Campbell ● 1973d

Entirely agree Paul!

Francis Rowe ● 1973d

Cllr Hearn also calls them 'mindless'.Clearly the people who did this did have minds in order to target about 20 locations, some being about a mile apart, in a single night.I see that the OneChiswick Facebook group were listing the locations of traffic counters a couple of days before they were vandalised.  So a handy guide for the vandals.

Michael Robinson ● 1973d

If you're driving East along CHR and turn right into, say, Dukes Ave, and collide with a cyclist in the cycle lane, travelling in the same direction, who's to blame?

Michael Brown ● 1973d

Talking with a cyclist who commutes to Chiswick to work told me east and central London cycle lanes are ready good and busy but west London a waste of time. In fact he doesn’t use the cycle lane preferring to use side roads. The concept to encourage cycling is a good one but let’s not put cycles lanes where they are rarely used at the expense of bus lanes. More people use buses than cycle. Dare I use the word common sense ha! I loved the comment the cycle lane is packed being a local who walks along the high road frequently I have never seen it packed a complete flight of fantasy 😂😂😂😂😂

Jayne Thorburn ● 1973d

Partly poor design Michael.I suggested a while back that the cycle path should have been painted bright yellow where it crosses a junction to highlight to both cyclist and driver that this is a area of heighten risk of collision.What did they use? Camouflage brown.

Adrian Irving ● 1973d

All the bus timings are available to TfL, and will be used to evaluate the changes on the bus service. For example, those showed during the previous period of assessment the services monitored were slightly quicker on average during peak times last Autumn.Similarly we have pollution monitoring on the High Road that is showing levels on the High Road have continued to be nearer to the background since C9 opened. You appear to be advocating ignoring consistently recorded data in favour of anecdotal evidence.

Tom Pike ● 1973d

Appeared Tom?  That's  not like you.Do you not have some recorded data  to back up your claim?If by speaking to people I was only cementing my view why don't you do the same?You never know you might find a driver that loves the new arrangements or even you contention that Hammersmith Bridge should remain closed to vehicles.Good luck.

Adrian Irving ● 1973d

Oh Clarabelle have I been misspelling your name ? Rid CHR of cars and dedicate it to bike and bus lanes is the solution.

Chris Vessey ● 1973d

Making CHR access only for cars from Acton Lane to Chiswick Lane should indeed be considered. Through traffic has the A4.And there's now money earmarked for just such schemes in the just-announced TfL settlement: "TfL will commit to set aside at least £100m within the 2021 Funding Period to continue the delivery of healthy streets and active travel programmes including funding for the London Boroughs under the local implementation plan process."

Tom Pike ● 1973d

"Rid CHR of cars and dedicate it to bike and bus lanes is the solution." And your solution for deliveries, tradesmen, emergency services, people that can only exit their road via CHR, etc. is?

Adrian Irving ● 1973d

Chris, maybe we could have gated check points and a secret password that changes everyday.You know, like East Berlin.

Adrian Irving ● 1973d

Embankment wasn't quicker before hand if you were cycling legally.  There are several sets of lights that are bypassed by the cycle lane.  Avoiding being stopped at red lights for a significant period of time means that the cycle lane is quicker in my experience.  I don't cycle it regularly these days, but I have cycled the Embankment quite a few times before the lane, and several times after it has been installed.That Embankment lane is not without its problems though.  The traffic light phasing on the junction getting up onto the lane on Blackfriars Bridge is as bad as the phasing on the lights by the Catholic church in Chiswick.

Al Webber ● 1973d

AdrianA few weeks ago on one my of bus journeys down King Street (one that I didn't need to bail out early for), the single decker bus driver, obviously hacked off with the daft red and white plastic 'pop up cycle lane' on King Street got so fed up with it, he squeezed his bus into the bike lane and we got to the front of the queue at the Goldhawk Road junction in usual bus lane timing. I was listening to 3 separate groups of people moaning about the length of bus journeys since the bus lanes had been removed, but I guess they don't matter either as they are anecdotal too. Problem with the journey from Goldhawk Road was that it stood still as there was the usual gridlock trying to get down Chiswick High Road, so we sat and waited until we could get back onto the high road. One thing i have noticed, as I don't live far from the High Road is the constant standing traffic, but also the black dust increase in my house. Constantly cleaning off the increased pollution from various rooms and windows.

J Morse ● 1973d

Brilliant idea. Make CHR access only and convert South Parade into a dual carriageway to deal with the displacement.

Jeremy Parkinson ● 1973d

Very funny forget about the poor people who live here, there are some selfish crazy people in Chiswick perhaps you should all move out if you find cars so offensive.

Jayne Thorburn ● 1973d

The place for the cycleway is adjacent to A4 - lots of unused space and a direct quick route from east to west.    Families gawping at stationary traffic on the High Road on a weekend cycle trip is nonsense.  I’ve used the cycleway from Kew Bridge to Hammersmith for fun as an alternative to cycling around Richmond Park.  It’s fun to cycle past the parked cars and look at the empty shops - I didn’t stop to shop and my circular trip started and ended at home.    They need to think again and put the super cycleway  next to the A4.  With electric cars increasing in number the pollution argument is bogus.

Charles Carr-Jones ● 1973d

Charles you talk sense thank goodness someone does offer a sensible solution

Jayne Thorburn ● 1973d

There does need to be a lane on the A4.  It will be a lot safer for cyclists with very few pedestrians, and a lot less junctions.  Most incidents happen at junctions.It would also be a good 5 minutes quicker from Chiswick to Hammersmith by bike.  Most people who start cycling are going to do it for the commute.  Making it 5 minutes (maybe more) slower is not going to encourage people to do it.Having said that, the High Road cannot go back to what it was before. The painted "cycle lane" disappeared where the road narrowed at zebra crossings and forced bikes to move out into the main traffic lane. It would be better to have no lane than that.Further along, the "cycle lane" was some green paint right in door zone of parked cars.  That was hugely dangerous.  I used to cycle further out with the cars.  That's not just a theoretical risk either.  I've been doored 4 times cycling in London.  It would have been 5 times if I hadn't got into the habit of cycling a car door's width out from parked cars.We need to fix the High Road, not just go back to what it was before, but the cycle provision needs to be with traffic, rather than have people cycling East along the South side of the High Road.

Al Webber ● 1973d

Jayne, yes cars are offensive. I recommend you watch "Traffic Cops" on Channel 5 Tonight at 8.00 o'clock.

Chris Vessey ● 1973d

Charles the pollution argument is even greater with electric cars I think you will find.

Chris Vessey ● 1973d

CV:"...but no through traffic."Presumably you mean all 'no through traffic' which therefore must include no cycling through traffic ?

Loraine Pemberton ● 1973d

Dear Charles, you are absolutely right about the move to electric cars and pollution, and that the best place for the cycleway is adjacent to the A4. Agree with you 100%.

Rae Lewis ● 1973d

CV:"That'll stop the riff raff entering the Kingdom of Chiswick"Does that include the cycling riff raff ?Just asking  😉

Loraine Pemberton ● 1973d

LP no , the car riff raff. Reduction of car use is our aim. Cyclists can go where they wish. Use of cars in CHR reduced to minimum. Buses run freely on CHR with no hold ups or queues.

Chris Vessey ● 1973d

There should be cycle lanes on the A4 *and* on CHR.There should be cycle lanes everywhere.How else are we ever going to save the planet, reduce pollution, etc?Everyone switching to electric cars helps a bit, by (maybe) reducing C02 a bit, but it's not enough. It doesn't reduce tyre pollution.

Simon Pedley ● 1973d

"There should be cycle lanes everywhere"Simon please expand on this and explain why.

Cllr Sam Hearn ● 1973d

Will, if you hark back to through the mists of time you may remember that the TfL consultation document on what was then Cycle Superhighway 9 placed great stress on the benefits it would provide in terms of cycle commute times.The rebranding came, according to articles were published nearer the time, when consultants told TfL that although they were having great success in increasing the numbers cycling, the uptake wasn't very diverse in terms of race, age, gender or income.Hence Cycle Superhighway 9 became Cycleway 9 with safety emphasised over speed and the intention of broadening the cycling base rather than making those that already cycle, cycle more.

Mark Evans ● 1973d

Creating congestion increases pollution we spend at least 15 minutes more in congestion to get home on most occasions we can’t be alone. The cycle lane design has created more pollution not less. Whatever happened to the theory that road designs should aim to reduce congestion, keep traffic moving? We seem to have gone backwards a real shame.

Jayne Thorburn ● 1973d

Quite a nice example of a ‘culture war’ this thread. For example, comments about a “handy guide for the vandals”, that didn’t mention the ‘guest blogger’ who previously posted detailed maps of their locations across Grove Park.https://chiswickcalendar.co.uk/dramatic-drops-in-traffic-in-south-chiswick/

Russell Pearson ● 1973d

Claire, when I left Halfords last Thursday a stationary queue from Turnham Green to Gunnersbury RAB this at 11.00am but no cycle route 9 there holding/slowing the traffic. Just too much traffic, its own worst enemy. You motorists just need someone to blame for your very own shortcomings. It's nothing to do with the cycle lane, you motorists are the problem, there's too many of you on CHR.

Chris Vessey ● 1973d

"Quite a nice example of a ‘culture war’ this thread"My understand of a culture war is that one side is progressive and wants positive change while the other side will do or say anything to frustrate that change.Is that what you're seeing on this thread?

Ed Saper ● 1973d

No. That’s classic culture war rhetoric. But good try.

Russell Pearson ● 1973d

I've never used C9 for commuting - but I use it twice daily for the kids' school drops.If I'm cycling straight to the office then I suppose I'm technically a commuter?  Not done that much during lockdown :-)I only got on a bike because the traffic was so awful and could add 30-50 minutes onto a trip by car or bus.  I know people value the bus lane that's been ripped up for the cycle lane, but I don't remember a bus lane!  There were some short stretches that went West, usually around the bus stops and I think a short stretch that went East between TGT and the little Sainsburys.    But when it was traffic gridlock, all the buses were stuck too.  I bailed out of several Westbound buses around Turnham Green (the Green, not the tube)  with a tired toddler to walk because we'd been stuck for half an hour and he needed a wee!  Thinking about it - wasn't there actually a cycle lane where the cycle lane is? 

Ed Saper ● 1973d

Ah - nearly had you there :-). I think the philosophy of conservatism is to prevent well meaning change by people who haven't thought through the consequences.  Although that does just sound like an excuse not to do something you don't really want to do!I like PJ O'Rourke's attitude:"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences."

Ed Saper ● 1973d

Percentage wise the biggest loss of bus lane is between Goldhawk Road and Chiswick Lane but you can see what used to be there on Google Streetview. There has been a substantial loss of priority for buses in Chiswick which combined with the reduction in service over the last few years is causing significant problems.There is no doubt that there has been an increase in parents using the cycleway to take their kids to school but this appears to have risen to low double digits on a daily basis. Assuming a proportion of these trips were previously walked then the modal shift is limited. More importantly as they will tend to be short trips the overall impact on traffic is less.A commuter trip will tend to be longer and therefore unlikely to have been made by walking therefore the impact of a modal shift is greater.There are a lot of unknowns here but if any increase in leisure/school run cycling is outweighed by a reduction in commuters who stop cycling because they find the cycle lane is slowing their trip then there is an issue.Cycle commuting may remain the better option if congestion is bad but the offset to that is that some bus users may be switching to cars because of the unreliability of the service.All this happening during a pandemic makes it really hard to make comparisons over time.

Mark Evans ● 1972d