Forum Topic

The signs are out there

So the assumption is that every driver sees, reads and understands every sign they pass and looks for it every time they pass. There are two signs most people will have driven past, but have you seen and understood them?I’d be interested if anyone knows anything about them, or if there are people brave enough to admit they haven’t seen or understood them. (Don’t worry it is highly unlikely you have committed an offence)The first one is the 30mph speed limit on the M4 elevated section, how long has it been there?The second is at Hogarth Roundabout, the signage is fairly unique. I’ve spent years looking for it repeated elsewhere, but have only ever seen it twice elsewhere. Do you know what the sign is, what makes it fairly unique and most importantly have you ever seen another one?

Colin Potter ● 2298d17 Comments

Come on Colin, make your quiz a bit easier... do people need to go around the Hogarth roundabout to see what you are talking about?What about posting links from google streetview?

Michael Robinson ● 2298d

Based on observing the new road 'closures' in the area, many drivers must be particularly unaware of the meaning of the 'low flying motorbike' sign (NO MOTOR VEHICLES).  Studies suggest that this is one of the least understood road signs, resulting in low levels of compliance, though not as bad as the totally blank white sign in a red circle, which means...?

Peter Evans ● 2298d

That was the point of the quiz, anyone that has driven over should already have seen and understood all of the signs. There should be no reason for anyone to go and have a look.Maybe you could explain the M4 30mph sign though. Is it the shortest 30mph zone in London?https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.4925274,-0.285162,3a,90y,224.35h,70.46t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sEkLFeDnOf6lki8YV7nJQhw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en

Colin Potter ● 2298d

No vehicles and yes it probably should be a better sign than that.

Tony Smart ● 2298d

According to the Highway Code, "Signs with red circles are mostly prohibitive.".  Surely the logical conclusion is that a totally blank white sign in a red circle means that ... nothing is prohibited. On that basis, perhaps an analysis of that sign would show high levels of compliance. It's not only drivers who are confused. The sign of a red circle around a bike strongly indicates to people who cycle that they can cycle there, if the invective and display of single or two fingers are reasonable measurements when its meaning is mentioned to them politely and calmly.  https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/58170307ed915d61c5000000/the-highway-code-traffic-signs.pdf

Joanna Biddolph ● 2298d

Cllr Biddolph is as predictable as ever...

Michael Robinson ● 2298d

"Maybe you could explain the M4 30mph sign though. Is it the shortest 30mph zone in London?"Evidently you need to revise your knowledge of road signs.  That sign on the M4 is merely advisory of a recommended maximum speed around the bend.  It's NOT a mandatory speed limit, which would be indicated by "30" inside a red circle.And the "fairly unique" sign at the Hogarth Roundabout: is it at the roundabout itself?The only unusual sign that I recall from that area is the "motor vehicles only" sign (white motorbike over car on a blue circular disc) which is on two signs approaching the Hogarth flyover on A316.

Richard Jennings ● 2298d

Richard, there is also a “Weak Bridge” sign at the Hogarth roundabout for the flyover. There are weight and width restriction signs as well so maybe the Weak bridge is intended to draw attention to the weight restriction.

Michael Robinson ● 2298d

Michael You're embarrassing yourself with your predictable rants against Cllr Biddolph, you never miss an opportunity to take a swipe at her. Other than OCD about Cllr Biddolph, what's your problem with her ? Oh wait a minute it's about CS9/CW9, get over it - you're getting this dangerous and ill thought out cycle Lane down CHR.Btw you do remember it wasn't just Cllr Biddolph who had, and still have, grave concerns about it don't you  - you know Residents,  businesses and the other Councillorsin Chiswick, or perhaps you've conveniently forgotten that wee fact ?

Loraine Pemberton ● 2298d

I noticed the 30mph one a few weeks ago as I shot past at 50. No idea about the hogarth roundabout, and as for the Circle sign, isnt that a straight forward 'No Entry'?

Stephen Gould ● 2298d

Ah, here comes Cllr Biddolph's public relations officer, just like clockwork.As the Chiswick councillors said in their recent transport policy statement “It is time to move on” regarding CW9 so I’m glad they have accepted it.In her presentation to the Hounslow cabinet, Cllr Biddolph herself said she supported a protected cycle lane along both sides of CHR. That may have come as a surprise to the people who signed Cllr Biddolph's petition but it is on the record. Pity you weren’t there to hear it for yourself.

Michael Robinson ● 2298d

Joanna is spot on about the bike in a red circle sign. Widely ignored or misunderstood.

Rob Reynolds ● 2298d

We are often told, here and elsewhere, that cyclists should take tests and be registered and 'obey' the Highway Code. Drivers take tests and are registered (or at least, most do) and yet it's freely admitted here that many don't understand and/or comply with signs explained in the Highway Code.Gosh!

Ken Munn ● 2298d

I know I need to reread my Highway Code, there are a few signs in there that I had to remember to pass my test, but have never seen since I started driving, so have forgotten what they mean.The 30mph sign has been there since before the average speed came into force, I thought it had been forgotten about as it has faded so much. When the new speed limits were introduced it appeared they employed two contractors, one to put signs up, one to take down signs. I’m not entirely sure if it is intentional or a mistake but I guess as we do not have to comply with the M4 sign, the shortest 30mph zone must be Lupus Street. It is a 20mph road, except for the junction with St Georges Drive, on one side of the lights it has 30mph signs, on the other side of the junction it has 20mph signs. I hadn’t thought about the blue low flying bike as being unique, it kind of means the opposite of the red and white version. If you know what the bicycle red/white and blue signs mean, it should make the No Motor Vehicle, Motor Vehicles Only self-explanatory.  A white sign with a red border as a triangle means give way. As a circle it means no vehicles, put a picture of a form of transport in the circle and it means none of that type of transport. (Have you seen the horse and cart one? I cannot think of one in West London) The sign on Hogarth Roundabout is the 3T m.g.w. I know people don’t know what it means as any time the police are there to enforce it, they end up with so many vans, they have to let others go through as there is no space left to stop them and process them.I know it confuses Ealing Borough Council as well. On the Three Bridges there are signs for 3T and 3T m.g.w. I know they mean the same thing, but if someone is not sure, having different signs either side of the roundabout isn’t going to help them. They have now reduced some of the confusion as they do appear to have now removed the 3.5t goods vehicle sign from Tentelow Lane.As some of the time when driving I would have to comply with the sign if I saw it, I do look for it. 18T m.g.w is fairly common but the only other place I have seen a 3T m.g.w sign is Camberwell Grove. Does anyone know of any others?

Colin Potter ● 2297d

My new favorite 30mph zone is the A40. The entire elevated bit is now 30mph. When headed west, the 40mph begins again just before the traffic signal at Bloemfontein Road. So...the part meant to ease traffic (on a ring road) is slower, and the part with all the lights and crossings is faster.

David Lesniak ● 2297d

So Mr.Munn it seems from your statement that because others break the law it's ok for cyclists to also break the law.

Jeffrey Cope ● 2297d

Not what I said. More a case of pots and kettles.

Ken Munn ● 2297d