Forum Topic

Chiswick Road closures

I really fail to understand why Turnham Green Terrace is being made “access only” (particularly with such poor signage, that in my book constitutes nothing short of entrapment to motorists) - all that will happen is that traffic will be taken away from a thriving street of businesses down a predominantly residential, already congested road. The residents of South Parade & the roads that will become rat runs behind it must be up in arms! The additional proposal to close Fishers Lane will push all traffic past the park Chiswick Park tube (where there are loads of pedestrians) & into the already congested roads that access Sainsburys.By all means, pedestrianise / make cycle friendly Fishers Lane, but when you do, rethink the Terrace - closing both is bonkers!

Nicky McKenna ● 2297d47 Comments

Unfortunately both Hounslow and Ealing council are run by morons, who don’t live in the area and therefore have no clue what a disaster they’re creating. I understand that Ealing council plan to close the fishers lane underpass around about the 27th July and restrict access to cyclists and buses. Obviously they don’t care about car drivers and gridlock in the area. I don’t understand why the local Chiswick councillors can’t put a stop to this ridiculous nonsense.

Samantha Rabin ● 2297d

You can make comments, which will probably been roundly ignored if past performance is a measure, here:https://haveyoursay.hounslow.gov.uk/traffic-and-transport/streetspace-feedback/

N V Brooks ● 2297d

Like you I am at a loss as to why Turnham Green Terrace being closed to traffic. Chiswick High Road is always busy and currently more so with gas roadworks going on. Over the last week or so I've noticed traffic getting increasingly heavy and on occasions I have walked quicker between Goldhawk Road and Chiswick Lane that a car or bus has taken to do same journey. This has been mid afternoon and I dread to think what it will be like when schools all return and more people get back to work.This is yet another ill thought out decision made by council and needs serious reviewing.

Dean Isaac ● 2297d

Unfortunately Chiswick's councillors belong to the "wrong" party and being in a small minority their views are completely  ignored by the ruling majority, usually with added relish.

Bruce Hammal ● 2297d

And then there's CS9 coming on top of it, with narrower lanes and even less parking space. It all unfolds exactly as LBH been told but didn't want to listen, supported by UIs citing Amsterdam and whatnot.

Adam Pycz ● 2297d

These changes are being made precisely in response to statutory government Covid guidance which requires councils to restrict access for motor vehicles at certain times (or at all times) to specific streets, or networks of streets, particularly town centres. and high streets to enable active travel but also social distancing in places where people are likely to gather.I wish they’d get on and enforce it frankly.

Edward Seaton ● 2297d

Edward, one of the other pro-closure posters (Michael I think) posted the other day. I will repeat what I posted then, this is simply not true. THere are a range of measures available to local authorities, it is entirely at their discretion the number and nature of the schemes they put forward. The DfT guidance page lists a dozen such measures, such as pop up cycle lanes and closing parking.Many will support Fishers Lane as a rat run, but TGT is an important local link road. It will cause masssive congestion along Acton Lane and South Parade, as well as the roads like Sutton Lane around Turnham Green.Crucially, as I have pointed out to you, it does not in any way facilitate social distancing on TGT. Many parking bays had already been closed to do this. THere are still buses, vans, local access traffic and scooters that make it impossible (or at least foolhardy) to step into the carriageway. Lets stick to the facts.

Paul Green ● 2297d

Absolutely correct Paul. The framework to restrict traffic/increase pedestrian space/promote cycling use has indeed been published.The detail of what is implemented is wholly down to individual local authorities who are meant to run concurrent consultations on their proposals in the affected areas and clearly publish the results of such consultations.

N V Brooks ● 2297d

I agree with those criteria, but the only schemes clearly intended to meet them are TGT and Devonshire Road. The Grove Park scheme seems to be general traffic calming measures in a residential area rather than a 'town centre or High Street', as is Green Dragon Lane, Occupation Lane and many of the other schemes proposed by Ealing. Even closing Fishers Lane will offer no direct improvement for pedestrians. The problem with the TGT scheme in particular seems to be the inability or unpreparedness of traffic to take any notice of it, which can only be solved by more obvious signs and structures rather than by clocking up penalty charges without providing the intended benefit.

Peter Evans ● 2297d

No the detail of what is implemented is not solely down to Councils. The DfT has signed off the schemes that meet its criteria. It has rejected the schemes that do not such as RBKC’s nearly £600k request to fund a quietway cycle scheme. The DfT disagrees with the opponents of these schemes in Chiswick as it has approved and funded them because they follow the guidance issued.

Paul Campbell ● 2297d

There are indeed a range of measures Paul. The DfT statutory guidance includes closure of high streets to motorised vehicles to encourage active travel. In other words to make it less attractive to drive for journeys that can be walked or cycled. That’s closure of TGT and Devonshire, Fishers and no entry on Dukes Road. Can you suggest any high streets you’d prioritise locally?It also requires pop-up cycle lanes, which I expect to happen on Chiswick High Road and should happen in Sutton Court Road and Chiswick Lane. It requires modal filtering, which has just happened at Stile Hall Gardens and Wellesley Road, is happening in Grove Park and South Chiswick and should be considered for Dukes Avenue area and Bedford Park. Councils were instructed to do this within weeks and to use experimental traffic orders which is what’s happening. Active travel is being prioritised in Chiswick. Our local councillors are in the curious position of opposing measures that have been taken in response to their own government’s mandates, despite having initially released a statement welcoming the guidance, but utterly devoid of specifics. It fooled me for a couple of weeks. The local Carservatives have reverted to type sadly. It’s as if they think they can have their cake and eat it.

Edward Seaton ● 2297d

"Councils were instructed to do this within weeks and to use experimental traffic orders which is what’s happening."Isn't that slightly disingenuous on your part as it's only if the local councils what to claim the Government grants or are you saying that's incorrect  ?

Loraine Pemberton ● 2297d

These mad schemes all throughout Chiswick are nothing to do with increasing better access for cyclists and pedestrians - they do neither in any place in W4.  It is all to do with MONEY and greedy Councils bidding for part of the £250 million offered by the Sec. of State for TRANSPORT.  He should be drummed out of the Brownies for this idiotic scheme imo.  I will start a new thread on this - it ain't got nuffink to do with making life better for people

Jennifer Selig ● 2297d

This may be the slowest penny drop I have ever seen. It is getting painful to watch. RBKC submitted multiple schemes because they had to follow the instructions not because they are supportive of the government’s policy. The only meaningful approval was for a pop-up cycle Lane on High Street Ken. They are now on the naughty step for being dense and not doing as central government said. Wandsworth, another Conservative Council with a less than progressive record on active travel, closed Northcote Road because of the DfT’s instructions. That was unthinkable before Shapps announced the new policy.Chiswick’s Conservatives might find it a bit easier to argue against the supporters of these schemes if they just admit that they are opposed to their government. The current stance of pretending that the government hasn’t designed the policy, issued the instructions, set the guidance, reviewed and approved or rejected every individual scheme put forward by every LA in the country, and funded ambitious efforts to reallocate road space and reduce traffic by doing exactly what is happening in Chiswick all over London and around the country, is not credible.

Paul Campbell ● 2297d

So is it just the Secretary of State for Transport’s fault? Boris Johnson himself is keen on promoting active travel as well. At Prime Minister’s Questions on 6th May he said that the post pandemic era ‘should be a new golden age for cycling’. Ruth Cadbury agrees, Sadiq Khan agrees, Hounslow cabinet agree.

Edward Seaton ● 2297d

What is not credible is that DafT have either the wherewithal or expertise to review all submissions in the timscale this far.  Thay have pleaded chronic understaffing since Patrick 'West Coat mainline'McLoughlin  and  Chris 'no boats' Grayling was heading it up.How they have now found the staff required to review and approve all of these cases in incredible; no' it simply lacks credibility.

N V Brooks ● 2297d

Paul,As I’ve mentioned before, it is pointless trying to claim that the measures on DR and TGT don’t meet government policy for reallocation of road space when they clearly do. If you disagree then rather than wasting time on this website you should be writing to the DfT who have provided the funding (and who didn’t provide funding to many other council schemes that didn’t meet their requirements). Let us know how you get on.The measures on TGT aren’t even enforced yet. There are plenty of additional measures that could further improve the streetscape so these are just the first steps.

Michael Robinson ● 2297d

Well there are vast tables of these schemes with the DfT’s decision to fund, partially fund or reject from all the LAs. So what’s your theory? Did they pick them out of a hat and LBH got lucky while RBKC got shafted?

Paul Campbell ● 2297d

"...golden age for cycling. Ruth Cadbury agrees, Sadiq Khan agrees, Hounslow cabinet agree."Think you're confused about what a 'Golden Age' is. The only age that was truly golden was brought about by a  magnificent, far sighted and ambitious woman who knew how to inspire, lead and manage through maintaining a balance of power.With Boris Johnson, Ruth Cadbury, Sadiq Khan and the Hounslow Cabinet, it's doubtful they could even grasp the concept of a Golden Age, much less being inspirational and effective leaders.

Loraine Pemberton ● 2297d

“ Think you're confused about what a 'Golden Age' is. The only age that was truly golden was brought about by a  magnificent, far sighted and ambitious woman who knew how to inspire, lead and manage through maintaining a balance of power.”Are you describing Joanna Biddolph?

Edward Seaton ● 2297d

NV. It’s not rocket science.  Local authorities needed to complete a pro forma per scheme with how the scheme met the DfT requirements. It’s not difficult to quickly vet the proposals for anyone familiar with the subject matterSecondly, “the dogs on the street” know what local authorities have a track record of implementation and which ones are bullshitters paying lip service (like RBKC). There would have been more scrutiny for some councils than others.

Michael Robinson ● 2297d

So is it just the Secretary of State for Transport’s fault? Boris Johnson himself is keen on promoting active travel as well. At Prime Minister’s Questions on 6th May he said that the post pandemic era ‘should be a new golden age for cycling’. Ruth Cadbury agrees, Sadiq Khan agrees, Hounslow cabinet agree.Dr Edward SeatonThe golden age has come and gone the world has been on a slow downward slide since the seventy's.Most people in their life time have their ups and downs, while having to alter their way of life due to a well meaning but completely out of touch politician.My all means get rid of Rat runs, if the forum search goes back far enough you will find discussions by local Chiswick residents discussing a way to stop vehicles from using Chiswick as a means to short cut major roads.But during these discussions the LBOH didn't want to know, or do anything about it. Until a misguided Boris Johnson decides to wade in with his size 10 boots, and the government on the back of Covid -19 decides to dangle a lot of money underneath local authority's nose.Through the knee jerk actions of other local authority's I have found the one of my recreational outlets of visiting large parks is now severely curtailed as a large percentage of Large parks are not letting Cars to enter to use their ar parks. This now has stopped my wife and I from enjoying large open spaces which are now only for safety of Cyclists and pedestrians.In the late Sixties through to the mid seventy's, I used to drive to Bunda a village in limburg. While there I used to drive regularly from Bunda to Maastricht, and founf that there was no roads that were blocked or forced you to drive a long way round to get to where you wanted.The Road infrastructure then was safely laid out to allow cyclist and vehicles to existed together in a very old part of Holland. The local traffic wasn't impeded in where you wanted to go and no fines for getting it wrong.Although the measures are being install al over the borough I haven't checked, but I think a lot more measures have been or going to be installed in Chiswick, because the leader of the council always wants to get one over the 9 Chiswick Tory Councilors, they are a thorn in his side.Its like other things that he's always been against doing in Parks and open spaces, and letting Charities and friends groups do the work for the council and pull in approximately one and half million pounds of funding to build the and restore Duke Meadows to the Place is is today.Now I see in that latest Hounslow Publication, the Council is taking the credit for some of the work carried out by Charities and friends groups.So pardon me for seeing right through the latest measures on the back of Cyclist and pedestrian Safety.         

Bernard Allen ● 2297d

History clearly isn't your strong point.

Loraine Pemberton ● 2297d

History of what?

Bernard Allen ● 2296d

Utter exaggerated rubbish. RBKC have a long track record of blocking cycling improvements, which may explain their lack of success, or it may be the schemes they suggested were not great. But they are not on 'the naughty step'. that is not how funding to LA works, apart from exceptional grants as in this case. If they are being punished that would be exceptionally short sighted as its the local residents that suffer. No LA has to 'do' anything. However, all recognise the challenges the current situation brings, the risks of the virus and the avoidance of public transport. So that is why they are choosing to apply for funds. It is entirely at the discretion of the LA what they apply for, but given the general lack of cash they are incentivised to apply. So the closure of TGT is an LBH decision. The DfT is not familiar with the local geography or the implications of the closure of both TGT and Fishers La, but LBH should be. Northcote Rd may be closed but there a number of parellel roads in a short distance, both minor and major routes. LBH is proposing to close two of the three routes across the tube lines, meaning one mile diversions in either direction and pushing more traffic onto already heavily congested roads. Without addressing traffic flows from the M4 it will lead to gridlock once life recovers.

Paul Green ● 2296d

BernardIt was a reply to Edward Seaton

Loraine Pemberton ● 2296d

Facts Paul. All working against you. RBKC put forward schemes that do not restrict traffic or reallocate road space and that is why they were rejected. They have been touting their Quietway as an alternative to the HPA scheme for over a year and they got told quite clearly that it is not acceptable, They asked for funding for the pavement widening at Notting Hill Gate which is dangerous for cyclists and got nothing. The DfT has said that subsequent rounds of funding will go to the deserving. RBKC has been punishing its residents for years by doing nothing so the DfT is preserving the status quo which is what their most vocal residents have said they want for a long time now. LBH got the  funding because they proposed schemes that met the criteria. It is as simple, unexaggerated and fresh as that. Your personal passion for driving through TGT does not change the facts.

Paul Campbell ● 2296d

Think you're confused about what a 'Golden Age' is. The only age that was truly golden was brought about by a  magnificent, far sighted and ambitious woman who knew how to inspire, lead and manage through maintaining a balance of power.Unless you lived north of Watford.

Tony Smart ● 2296d

Surely the reference is to the golden age of Elizabeth 1st not the woman from Grantham!

Bruce Hammal ● 2296d

Someone mentioned in the Grove Park thread that the E3 bus would no longer go to Grove Park.  Is that true? Does anyone know if there is any change in the normal E3 routing?  Won't be taking it in the forseeable future but would be nice to know in case I feel confident enough to access public transport in the future...

Claire Moran ● 2296d

I got the impression that was scare-mongering rather than having any foundation in truth. Mind you if the traffic is so bad that nothing can get across the A4 at Sutton Court Rd  the end result will be exactly the same.

Bruce Hammal ● 2296d

The Reason that the E3 was diverted down Staveley Road was to try and get Staveley Gardens within the 400 meters walk to a bus stop.Take it Away and Edensor Road and further would not be any where near that distance to public transport.I also believe the Public transport should be able to get you to a place within your town. So the 190 only gets to the far end of the high road only and is a poor service.

Bernard Allen ● 2296d

Just to say that in addition to Hounslow's Streetspace feedback page you can also comment on the measures through the Tfl website. There are also some interesting points on how the temporary measures will be evaluated in terms of making them permanent. It's not reassuring reading if you're hoping for a level playing field, but when was it any different?https://tfl.gov.uk/travel-information/improvements-and-projects/streetspace-for-london?cid=email_FINAL_TFL363_Active_Travel_Cycling_Service_EM1-Streetspace+for+London#on-this-page-4

Bruce Hammal ● 2296d

Two of the new traffic measure to be installed In Chiswick maybe need a redesign.While bopping along Barnes alley on my alternative transport, I thought I spotted a vehicle exiting the railway bridge.When I got down to the railway bridge another small vehicle was edging its way past the restrictions, the female driver had a very determined look on her face.There’s something about the female mind, when presented with an obstruction, they tend to look at it and think you not going to beat me and have a go at getting past I it, where a male will give up and turn around.A bit like kicking the washing machine to get it going. When you try it It doesn’t work.Well it looks as though a certain size of car can still get under the railway bridge, with a determined driver at the wheel.This also shows if we do something regularly enough, sometimes we do things on auto pilot, like me letting a vehicle out of SHG without a though until I got into Brentford, hold on that road is ment to be blocked off from the Main road, how did it exit SHG?

Bernard Allen ● 2293d

Surely on the general thinking that men are more confident and capable drivers it will be men squeezing through gaps that ladies like me would never attempt.

Maggie Dodge ● 2293d

I think that Bernard may have been taking a little pop at the distaff side with his comments.

Andrew Jones ● 2293d

Im assumingn there has been no impact analysis, or pre/post traffic measurement by either of these councils that will allow proof that their experiment is and will be an utter failure -  if you dont measure, you can bask in the daft idea that TGT will be one of these mock-up artists impressions used to seel housing developments  of smiling couples, dancing children , sun shining, money being thrown into tills and the occasaional cylclist witha frint basket full of flowers to fill the front room of their perefct lifeReality is that shutting two of three ways in and out of chiswick , on top of the ( what appears to be) triple cycle on king street /the highroad will increase congestion, pollution and dabger to pedestrians and poush traffi away from mainroads to side roads.The " weve got to save the world" limp wristers may bask in the glory of a perfect world by ridding themsleves of the beastly car  howevevr it isnt- pedestrian only roads rapidly become ghettos  and unsafe as there is less passing traffic and general buzz of activityYesterday residents of islington blocked the road and marched on islington town hall to register their disgust as what their council has done in bringing in these uncalled for road closures - question here is, whio;s up for the same !

Tim Garfoot ● 2292d

Brilliant that the protestors blocked the road! Classic self-own.

Paul Campbell ● 2292d

You mean like when Extinction Rebellion blocked bus routes and disrupted the Tube ?

Richard Greenhough ● 2292d

That was very stupid as well yes.

Paul Campbell ● 2292d

Apparently maximum disruption is acceptable if you have occupied the moral high ground. Those of us who have yet to see the light (aka blind support for every single road closure put forward) are not allowed to protest or even register our disagreement. There is a plan whereby the 11k vehicles a day on the A4 all disappear, despite the complete absence of any plan or disincentive, and none ever come into Chiswick. Its seemingly fine for Paul to object to 'rat running' through GP, but in the absence of any plan to address the issue in the rest of Chiswick we shouldnt worry our little heads about where the displaced traffic goes.

Paul Green ● 2292d

Maggie, honestly, I have to admit that the worst drivers on English roads are men. Middle aged men in particular. Ladies are generally far better drivers. It was a surprise for me originally, but it is what it is.

Alex Shpinkov ● 2292d

As I have said before I am more than happy to help anybody who wants to lobby for any scheme that reduces rat running. I'd start with Dukes, Barrowgate, Wavendon etc. if I were a resident there. Filter it all like the far-sighted residents of Beverley and the adjoining streets did yonks ago.

Paul Campbell ● 2292d

Men in BMWs especially.

Richard Greenhough ● 2292d

No. Mostly men in Mercs. And in Jags.

Alex Shpinkov ● 2292d

https://aseasyasridingabike.wordpress.com/2015/12/26/audis-in-houses/

Michael Robinson ● 2292d

My understanding is many Chiswick Councillors support the road closures - I rarely say this about Chiswick Councillors but they have the long term interests of the area, and the vast majority of the residents, at heart . That is those residents who recognise the need to free our street from cars and get people walking and cycling , whenever possible - remember the vast majority of car journeys in London are under 5 miles you can cycle that in under 30 mins.

John Stroud ● 2290d